Buffyforum

av **Mr Chase** » fre mar 12, 2004 21:57

Om någon skulle hota mig med en motorsåg, eller förvandla sig till Jenny Calendar, så skulle jag säga tvåan.

av **Kuno** » lör mar 13, 2004 3:00

Hmmm....vette sjutton om jag inte tyckte bättre om dubbelavsnittet Surprise/Innocence. Givetvis var detta en magnifik säsongsavslutning, men mina förväntningar var kanske för höga. Dessutom förstörs lite av spänningen och kraften i avlslutet i och med att man VET att Buffy kommer tillbaka nästa säsong och att Angel får en helt egen TV-serie framöver. Fast HUR han kommer tillbaka vet jag förstås inte.

Men visst är det starkt. Fast jag måste klaga lite till tror jag.

Dom (Joss och gänget) slösade verkligen bort Kendra. Hon var ju en slayer för sjutton! Hon kunde i alla fall få dött i en sjujäkla fajt.

av **Zaxx** » lör mar 13, 2004 10:19

Kuno skrev:Dom (Joss och gänget) slösade verkligen bort Kendra. Hon var ju en slayer för sjutton! Hon kunde i alla fall få dött i en sjujäkla fajt.

mm det har jag tänkt på också. Kanske inte en stor fight precis, men hon borde iallfall få ett "coolare" slut. Detdär är bara lame....

samtidigt som det ändå är riktigt STORT ögonblick i avsnittet!

av **karykh** » lör mar 13, 2004 10:26

Jag tycker det känns som hon dör så bara för att visa att Dru faktiskt är farlig, inte bara sinnessjuk. Vilket kommer lite väl sent i säsongen iofs.

av **Peak** » lör mar 13, 2004 11:56

Har för mig att jag läst nånstans att striden mellan Dru och Kendra skulle vara lite mer "vanlig", men någonting förhindrade detta, så det blev hypnosköret istället...

av **gaspode** » lör mar 13, 2004 14:10

För mig var det också så, det visade att Drusilla faktiskt var ganska farlig, något de spenderade halva säsongen med att få oss att tro, men sen aldirg visade. Men visst, det var alldeles för enkelt egentligen...

av **Mr Chase** » lör mar 13, 2004 14:29

Mr Chase behöver en kram:

34. Becoming, part 2

Well, if the set-up in part one was excellent, the second part was beyond excellent. As far as I know this is the best "Buffy" ever. Granted, I haven't seen all "Buffy" yet but even Joss Whedon would have a hard time topping this one. But then again, knowing who Joss is, he might very well pull it off.

Going into this two-parter you knew that they were going to succeed in raising Angel's soul but not in what context. The very first time I saw "Buffy" I was terrified that it would become some cheesy "Hi, honey, I'm back. No hard feelings, huh?" kind of return. But I had underestimated Joss. What he delivered was out of this world. Oh, sure Angel came back, but only to be sent to hell right away, and by Buffy of all people, in order to save the world. One of the saddest, most heart wrenching moments ever to have been depicted on the small screen.

Normally I care more about the other Scoobies than I do about the slayer but in this one my heart and soul goes out to the poor girl. She's been expelled from school, she's wanted by the police on suspected murder charges, she's gotten kicked out of her house and she has in effect killed the love of her life. It was all done in the line of slayer duty but that's no consolation. She gets absolutely no reward for it and leaves Sunnydale in the end, to the very appropriate lyrics of Sarah McLachlan's "Full of Grace". Perhaps a blatant trick played with the viewers' emotions but I'm not complaining. It works every time I watch it.

As a show "Buffy" plays on many different levels -- sometimes it's horror, sometimes it's comedy and sometimes it's tragedy, like in this one. Sometimes it mixes. They all work however, which says a lot about the strength and quality of the writing and directing. It is almost impossible not to take this show seriously.

We've all wanted to say a nasty thing or two to principal Snyder and laugh at his expense. Here finally Buffy calls him a "stupid little troll" but we don't laugh. They situation is way too perilous for that. When he calmly tells Buffy she's expelled it doesn't really register. There are more sinister forces at work that she has to deal with.

Angelus is frightening to behold. I'm glad we didn't see him torturing poor Giles but you can just tell that it wasn't nice.
Angelus: "I want to torture you. I used to love it, and it's been a *long* time. I mean, the last time I tortured someone, they didn't even *have* chainsaws."

And the brave watcher doesn't succumb. It is only after Drusilla twists his mind into believing that she is Jenny Calendar that he inadvertently slips. Of all the cruel things you could do to him, this must be the worst, making him believe he and Jenny still has a chance even if she's dead. I like to tell myself that whoever it was that possessed Willow in the end, when she was casting the soul restoration curse, in fact was Jenny speaking from the other side of the grave, taking just revenge.

Another nice twist which we shouldn't be that surprised about is Spike. Ever since Angelus came back Spike has been loathing him, waiting for a chance to get even. So Spike seeks an ally in none other than his mortal enemy, the slayer. You know what they say, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

Spike: "We like to talk big, vampires do. 'I'm going to destroy the world.' It's just tough guy talk. Strut round with your friends over a pint of blood. The truth is I like this world. You've got dog racing. Manchester United. And you've got people. Billions of people walking around like Happy Meals with legs. But then someone comes along with a vision. With a real passion for destruction. It's all right here. Angel could pull it off. Good-bye Piccadilly, Farewell Leicester Bloody Square. You know what I'm saying?"

So they form an uneasy alliance. Spike wants Drusilla back the way it was before. And didn't you just feel an enormous satisfaction when he at the critical moment rose from his wheelchair and started beating the crap out of Angelus. And Dru siding with Angelus, I guess Buffy was right, Spike is pathetic.

Spike (to Drusilla): "I don't want to hurt you, baby. Doesn't mean I won't."
He chokes her unconscious (small nit-pick, Dru is a vamp, doesn't need oxygen, so how can she be choked?) and takes off. Boy is he going to have a really pissed off girlfriend when she wakes up!

Buffy's mother finding out about her daughter's true slayer identity couldn't have come at a worse time. She has been way too blind to the strange occurrences at Sunnydale and when she has to deal with it, she fails miserably. She can't comprehend the truth of what Buffy says and Buffy hasn't got the time to explain it.

Joyce: "Well, it stops now!"
Buffy: "No, it doesn't stop. It *never* stops. Do you think I chose to be like this? Do you have any idea how lonely it is? How dangerous? I would *love* to be upstairs watching TV or gossiping about boys or, god, even studying! But I have to save the world. Again."

But looking at it from Joyce's perspective what she did makes more sense. All she knew was that her little girl was involved in some pretty dangerous stuff and calling on her parental authority she forbids Buffy to go after whatever baddies are out there. She's just a mother trying to protect her young. When that fails and she can't physically restrain her daughter she blurts out the last resort: "You walk out of this house, don't even *think* about coming back!" She probably regretted it the second after she uttered it but it's too late. Buffy leaves and is in no state to tell the nuances of her mother's rejection. So she doesn't come back.

There nevertheless is a funny, if restrained, moment before that when Joyce and Spike sit together in awkward silence in the Summers' living room, not knowing what to say to each other.
Joyce: "Have we met?"
Spike: "Um... you hit me with an axe one time. Remember? Uh, 'get the hell away from my daughter'."
Joyce: "Oh."

The Slayerettes perform their duties as is befitting them. Xander helps rescue Giles while the other incants the curse. But Willow should learn to be more careful with witchcraft. If she keeps this up it is going to come back and bite her big time.

There has been complaints about Xander not telling Buffy what they were up to with the curse. His motives have been questioned as being not entirely pure, what with disliking deadboy and everything. But come on, give him some credit. In her emotional state Buffy shouldn't be burden with the knowledge that there was a slight chance of Angel's soul coming back. She was as close to getting killed by Angelus as it was and her holding back in the vain hope of Angel’s return would *not* have helped. I think Xander made a sound and rational call.

Some have also tried to make something of Xander saying to the then unconscious Willow that he loves her. I don't know, Joss's mind is a twisted one, but I like to think of it as that he loves her as a friend. After all, he said right before that she was his best friend. And he has Cordelia, dammit, and you can tell that she is in love with him even if she doesn't admit it. And he absently calls Cordy "honey" several times. They are actually strangely couply the entire episode and acts like it is the most natural thing in the world.

"In the end, you're always by yourself. You're all you've got. That's the point" Whistler says to Buffy and to a degree that is true. It is Buffy who finally must make the last judgement call. But without her friends she would never have gotten this far. In the final battle she's alone and has to take full responsibility for her actions, last but definitely not least, to herself.

The scene from when Angel returned as Acathla's vortex to hell started opening was indescribable. I knew even before Buffy did what she was going to do -- what she had to do --but it didn't help. It was *so* sweet and *so* sad and tragic. Them kissing and saying that they loved each other. Aw *sniff*. In the end, before she kills him, Buffy tells Angel to close his eyes. That's the same thing Darla said to him before she vamped him a quarter of a millennium ago or so. Angel, hereafter, you don't listen to a girl if she tells you to close your eyes.

av **Noggster** » lör mar 13, 2004 15:36

Längsta hittills? tog ett tag att läsa iaf, du har rätt på många punkter och fullt ut hela med många roliga citat, well done.

Och att du kunde gissa vad Buffy skulle göra visar väl ändå hur väl SMG visar ansiktsutryck? För jag antar att det inte bara var en ren gissning baserat på ingenting.

av **Mr Chase** » lör mar 13, 2004 16:33

Noggster skrev:Och att du kunde gissa vad Buffy skulle göra visar väl ändå hur väl SMG visar ansiktsutryck? För jag antar att det inte bara var en ren gissning baserat på ingenting.

Ansiktsuttryck i kombination med vad man vet om karaktären. Utmärkt skådespeleri i kombination med utmärkt författade och regisserande.

av **Teo** » sön mar 14, 2004 22:19

Vem har vågat ge becoming 8??

av **Langtry** » ons mar 17, 2004 19:41

*skrivs ner i boken för viktiga saker*
Satt och kikade lite på Caffeineaddicts wallpapers och upptäckte att Acathla är ganska så lik Shrek.

av **Teo** » ons mar 17, 2004 20:50

LOL Langtry alltså man kan dra paralleler men ändå shrek och acathla är väl ändå extremt..

av **Langtry** » ons mar 17, 2004 20:58

Men de var ju lite smålik varandra ju

av **noike** » ons mar 17, 2004 21:27

De kanske är halvbröder.

av **Langtry** » ons mar 17, 2004 21:41

Kanske det

Acathla kanske är familjens "svarta får"

MP3 · av **caffeineaddict** » ons mar 17, 2004 22:09

Tror Shrek är det svarta fåret. Han får bo i ett träsk med en åsna, medan Acathla åtminstone har möjligheten att förstöra världen.

av **Zaxx** » ons mar 17, 2004 22:12

Langtry skrev:*skrivs ner i boken för viktiga saker*
Satt och kikade lite på Caffeineaddicts wallpapers och upptäckte att Acathla är ganska så lik Shrek.

tycker jag med... liiiite då

av **Langtry** » ons mar 17, 2004 22:40

caffeineaddict skrev:Tror Shrek är det svarta fåret. Han får bo i ett träsk med en åsna, medan Acathla åtminstone har möjligheten att förstöra världen.

Tänkte också det först

av **Noggster** » ons mar 17, 2004 23:17

Shreck är inget svartfår.. han har ju en ÅSNA.. som låter som Eddie Murphy, what else could you ask for? (Hon bruden som låter som Cameron Diaz.. grr).

av **Teo** » tor mar 18, 2004 17:26

När sluta detta var en tråd om becoming och blev en tråd om likheten mellan shrek och Acathla??

av **gaspode** » tor mar 18, 2004 18:12

Teo:

Posted: Wed Mar 17, 2004 18:41
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*skrivs ner i boken för viktiga saker*
Satt och kikade lite på Caffeineaddicts wallpapers och upptäckte att Acathla är ganska så lik Shrek.

Alltså Igår kl. 18.41

av **Teo** » tor mar 18, 2004 19:12

Haha jätte kul gaspode..

MP3 · av **caffeineaddict** » tor mar 18, 2004 19:22

Acathla förekommer endast i Becoming och därför kan diskussioner om honom nog anses vara rätt för den här tråden.

Joss himself har väl någon gång kommenterat likheten mellan Acathla och Homer Simpson också.

av **Langtry** » tor mar 18, 2004 19:25

Jo lite Homer kan man nog också se i honom.

av **Noggster** » tor mar 18, 2004 19:56

Homer Simpson.. haha, hur får han ihop det?
Han som spelade Acathla(sten figuren) drack säkert massa öl bakom kulliserna.

av **Teo** » tor mar 18, 2004 19:57

Ja det var verkligen någon som spela Acathla oxå det tror jag inte men figuren varnog gjord av öl burkar

av **kaos** » lör apr 03, 2004 20:52

låter möjligt

av **Langtry** » lör apr 03, 2004 21:16

Vad ni svamlar =)

av **kaos** » lör apr 03, 2004 21:31

så sant

av **Langtry** » lör apr 03, 2004 21:33

Hehe

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